.
Feedback

Teacher Wonders Why Asian Students Tend To Get Best Grades

Patch columnist says most parents support teachers and push their kids to perform so why do the results seem so skewed? Is it the "Tiger Mom" effect?

 

This column is written by High School English teacher Jerry Heverly. 

Why are San Leandro Asian kids more successful students than other ethnic groups?

By Asian kids I mean, specifically, Vietnamese, Chinese, Korean, Indian and Pakistani children, male and female.

By “more successful students” I mean they are more cooperative, more polite, more respectful, more likely to be readers (the main route to success in English classes), more mature, far less likely to be discipline problems.

Obviously not all Asian kids meet this description.

And I’m aware that many kids from other ethnic groups do meet these criteria.

But with other groups the percentage of more successful students is much lower.

Yet even in my classrooms the relatively small number of Asian students in my lower track classes almost invariably get A’s or B’s.  Of my seven Asian students only one is below a B average for all classes collectively.

I’ve heard, as I’m sure you have, the standard answer to this question.

“It’s the parents,” I’m told. “In the Asian culture children are expected to be diligent and respectful.” Confucius did it.

It makes sense; since I have often heard Asian kids relate the pressure they get from their parents to do well in school.

The problem is that I hear the same thing from parents of other ethnic groups.

Often I’m asked to attend meetings meant to help struggling students.  I’ve written in a previous column about these (generally fruitless) endeavors.

Those meetings have convinced me of one thing. The parents of those failing students care deeply about their kids. And they expend extraordinary energy trying to guide their children towards school success.

The difference is in the results, not in the methods.

I’ve done web searches and read several books on this topic and invariably they turn into discussions of parenting styles. I read the famous Wall Street Journal review of Tiger Mom.

I don’t buy the assumption that Asian parenting is fundamentally different from that of Latino, African-American, Pacific Island, White, or any other group at SLHS.

I called a parent of an African American student last night. Her daughter had misbehaved in class, earning a referral to the office. Her GPA is very low. I dreaded the call.

Yet, like 98% of these calls, her mom was 100% supportive and a thousand percent committed to changing her child’s behavior.

My experience tells me, though, that it is unlikely that things will substantially and (most importantly) enduringly improve.

As a ninth grade teacher I see very few epiphanies among my students of all racial groups. (I will say, though, that many of my fifteen year old’s mature remarkably during their junior and senior years.)

I’ve read that Asian parents have stricter rules for their children. From what information I get from my students there are lots of folks out there with stringent curfews and draconian punishments for slip-up’s. And I mean parents of every ethnicity.

Fewer divorces and broken homes? I can’t cite statistics on this but my sense is that a higher percentage of my Asian kids have both parents at home. But I’ve also noticed that many have parents who work so many hours that the children virtually raise themselves.  

Biased teachers? Maybe we expect Asian kids to be smarter and thus our grades only reflect our prejudices? Maybe, but I strongly doubt it.

Work ethic? I have parents of every variety who slog through two or three jobs.

My point is that we tend to reason backwards. We see that Johnny with the pushy parents went to Harvard. We forget that Juan’s parents said the same things and wanted the same things for him, but somehow Juan didn’t get the memo.

I just don’t get it.

Read other columns from the Entirely Secondary archive. The tag line is inspired by education blogger Joe Bower who says that when his students do an experiment, learning is the priority. Getting the correct answer is entirely secondary.

Get San Leandro Patch delivered by email. Like us on FacebookFollow us on Twitter @sanleandropatch. Or start your own blog

Michael Moore January 27, 2013 at 12:43 am
Lynette, I am sure you are right about Jerry's class and the certainty of your son having a poor learning experience in Jerry's class. I am surprised that you are just figuring out that San Leandro as a community, SLHS's faculty and the school board in particular are focused on so many White Man characteristics, stereotypes and prejudices as to be pointless and unapproachable. Look at all the good White Folk who will chime in to point out that this is just not so. Right. Look at the appalling lack of persons of color and ethnicity teaching in the schools of San Leandro.
The community has a long tradition of White's only and being a less than welcoming home to others. You are right that you will be unsuccessful trying to talk to the teachers or to reason with the school board. They are the problem. It will not change until the folks who run the schools and teach in them speak the languages and live the cultures of their students. That is not likely to change any time soon. The best thing that can happen right now in Jerry's classroom is for Jerry to leave it and let the opportunity to teach English fall to someone who is representative of the majority of students, not some White Guy who is out of touch with what is wanted and needed. Fire Jerry Today!
David January 27, 2013 at 01:28 am
Where are you getting your research and what are the outcomes, and outside of Latinos (and I suspect there's a confounding factor there), do they control for single parent vs. 2 parent households?
David January 27, 2013 at 01:29 am
Michael, if you were on the "top ten" of the curve, I'll eat my hat.
David January 27, 2013 at 01:33 am
Actually, SLHS has better outcomes for black, Filipino, and Asian students than Berkeley high does, for example, probably surprisingly to you, Michael. Latino students do a bit better at Berkeley than SLHS.
And Michael, do you live in SL? Why? Do you hate yourself? You seem to have a serious problem or three.
Craig Williams January 27, 2013 at 02:09 am
When working on a local political campaign getting signatures I figured out that the library was a great place to get them . I also noticed a very high percentage of Asian kids using the library.
I often say public education is the greatest social invention in history. I think Asian especially immigrant Asian parents realize this. China when it first began trade with the U.S. asked for payment in college text books. Also Asians in lower income levels are also able to avoid "food deficiency" while non Asians of similar incomes often go to bed hungry.
Marga Lacabe January 27, 2013 at 02:54 am
Google Scholar!
The study on socioeconomic status & achievement is a meta study I found here: http://rer.sagepub.com/content/75/3/417.short The one on Latinos (and it just studied Latino two and single parent households) is here: http://hjb.sagepub.com/content/24/4/430.short Here is a comparison of dual vs. single parent households & student achievement in 11 countries: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1741-3737.2003.00681.x/abstract?deniedAccessCustomisedMessage=&userIsAuthenticated=false
Marga Lacabe January 27, 2013 at 03:00 am
How are Asians able to avoid food deficiency in a way non-Asians can't?
Fran January 27, 2013 at 11:38 am
Lynette if your son is unlucky enough yo get him as a teacher then transfer him out of his class immediately. Not for the biases he may hold but because he clearly has lost all passion as an educator of our children. Look at his past blogs. All he does is b@%^& and complain about his job. When called out to explain his ideas further, he never responds. He's probably one of those know-it-all teachers who demands respect for the simple fact he is in an authoritarian position.
Susan McReynolds January 27, 2013 at 01:09 pm
There was a study done on college students about why some demographic groups do better than others. I seem to recall that they were comparing Asians to Blacks. The premise was that students who study together tend to get better grades. I am not positive that this was a blinded and randomized (properly done) study, and I don't have the citation, but the results were significant that the talking and working together in groups to study resulted in better grades.
Asian families foster this practice. Apparently the black students tend to work more solitarily. And of course, since this study was done on college students, one would have to extrapolate to draw the conclusion that it holds true for high school students. But I pose that it would.
Craig Williams January 27, 2013 at 01:09 pm
I don't have the answere Marga but the point was noted in a UCLA study on how something like 15 percnt of Californians are food deficient mostly all in the bottom 15 percent of the population , yet poor Asians aren't.Food for thought!
Jessica Gardner January 27, 2013 at 10:01 pm
Just my opinion coming from a fellow student, the students of color are taught from an early age the way out is in sports they are the ones playing soccer, basketball and football, they are pushed to get passing grades. The Asian students are put into karate, music and are taught to be The best, less than an A is not acceptable. they also talk about colleges whereas at school the other kids place more of an emphasis on clothes they wear and working a part time job. This of course doesn't include the gang bangers that don't care about any of the above.
Teachers are human too, they want to teach to students that want to learn unfortunately this isn't the case for the majority of students and lots if not most teacher long gave up.
Leah Hall January 28, 2013 at 02:38 am
I think perhaps the true moral to this story is that education is not a one size fits all proposition for all student groups. The status quo favors some group over others, hence this debate. Some examples:
5 year-old boys tend to do badly if forced to sit still for a long time. Recent research shows that Latinos tend to excel when the right dynamics are brought to bear that engage their family support networks. Women are poised to start taking over the sciences now that they are getting better mentorship. Here is a prayer for our society that we start funding the education of our children like the treasure they are rather than lamenting why static approaches fail many of our students.
Leah Hall January 28, 2013 at 02:49 am
The link below seems apropo to this discussion. Perhaps what is needed in our system is to play to the strengths of our student support networks to mitigate the disadvantages they might have.
http://newscenter.berkeley.edu/2012/12/11/study-shows-mexican-american-toddlers-lag-in-literacy-skills-excel-in-social-skills/ I submit that all of our students want to excel, they are just often blocked by obstacles that need wise approaches to get around them. Complaining that a static-common approach is not working for all our students is not that useful.
jeffrey olsen January 28, 2013 at 04:34 am
I believe the best solution is to inflate salaries and benefits for SLUSD workers immediately
jeffrey olsen January 28, 2013 at 05:24 am
liberal public at this forum prefer to keep its strange approach.If they don't like facts they ignore the facts,more they want persecute people who remind these facts.you can lash a sea by Xerxes example of course,But all better theories are based on facts
And one of the facts that Asian or Russian kids who came here with one English word and 100 dollars in pocket are more successful in school than some students who were born here and are way more rich
David January 28, 2013 at 04:02 pm
...And so you support one-size fits all government-run warehouses (except for your own daughter).
Whereas a voucher system could allow for parents to choose the right school for their (individual, unique) children.
Marga Lacabe January 28, 2013 at 04:46 pm
David, stop it with this voucher thing. We've had this discussion over and over. If the school district said "fine, we give up, here is a $8K - or even $10K - voucher, do whatever you want with it", the Catholic church would rejoice, the Moonies would have a big smile, and the rest of us parents would be in deep shit.
Secular private schools in the East Bay cost anywhere from 15K to 30K a year (plus the obligatory fundraising, extra-curricular activities, etc.). The only schools that cost less are those supported by some religious organization. So yes, having vouchers would help /you/, David, to send your children to Assumption, where you want them to go (only that it wouldn't really help you as Assumption already can't accept all kids that apply). But it wouldn't help absolutely anyone else in the district.
David January 28, 2013 at 04:52 pm
If you like your local public school, have at it and send your kid there with his/her voucher.
And your assertion flies in the face of actual, real-life evidence as practiced in the rest of the country, and heck, in other countries.
Leah Hall January 28, 2013 at 04:59 pm
I have asked where the voucher movement is in the East Bay. A link, a flyer, something? All I hear is crickets. David & his voucher fantasy makes my ears bleed.
David January 28, 2013 at 05:14 pm
Secular private schools only cost that because they can charge that, and you're paying for the lacrosse field, golf course and tennis courts. I make no bones about preferring other school choices for my kids. I point out the hypocrisy of parents like Leah who prefer school choice for themselves and not for others, and would rather see other peoples' kids in failing government warehouses than mixing in their rarefied socioeconomic strata.
With the increased availability of vouchers, you would see more schools. At $9,000/head, use your imagination. With 30 kids, parents could rent some of the vacant office space downtown and hire 3 university professors (at a higher wage than they get at UC-Berkeley) to teach kids in a "grade school"* aka "home school," or "only" hire 2 equivalently qualified people and have plenty of money left over for other activities/computers/etc. There is no reason a private, non-religious school "has to" charge $15k/year, even here. You would rapidly see "middle class" options if vouchers were available. Leah, so-called progressives like you (in conjunction with the taxpayer funded teachers' unions) have destroyed any hope for "change" that you claim to so dearly love, by clinging bitterly (to use your favorite president's phrase) to an outmoded, 19th century method of schooling, and the funding of it (for other kids, not your own).
Marga Lacabe January 28, 2013 at 05:15 pm
Let's say I don't like my public school but I'm not rich enough to afford to pay an extra $10K on top of the voucher to send my kid to private school. What good does the voucher do me?
Maybe the cost differential between private and public schools are not as significant in other states or countries, great for them, but it doesn't help us any.
Marga Lacabe January 28, 2013 at 05:48 pm
David, there is no reason to believe that more private schools would appear out of nowhere if there were vouchers. There are *plenty* of people right now that would jump to put their kid in a private school if they could find one for just $9K a year. This is why Assumption and other Catholic schools have waiting lists - which often times include desperate non-Catholic parents that just can't afford to go secular. And this is why the "Principled Academy" - a /Moony/ school which operates from portable classrooms set on a parking lot and has no facilities whatsoever, can actually fill up. I think tuition is about $12K a year.
Sure, for $8K per student you could set up the type of "school" you suggest. But would /you/ want to send your kid to that school? I know I wouldn't. Why would that be a better educational model than the one we have now? And Leah, the reason why nobody but David is talking about voucher is exactly because the economics don't work. What people are talking about, and are doing, is setting up charter schools right and left. Personally I think that's a much better model than the voucher system, as it's more intrinsically equalitarian - but there are problems with it, as we have seen by the too frequent revocations of charters.
David January 28, 2013 at 05:58 pm
Marga, the state spends on average $11,455 per K-12 student, so that means it spends on average around $9,000 per K-8 student and $15,000 per 9-12 student. Plus all your local bond measures (in SLUSD, amounting to $20,000 per student).
No one sets up a school for $9k/year because: 1) the target audience are parents who can pay $9k/year. These parents can't afford $9k/year *ON TOP* of the $5, 6, 7k they're paying in property taxes. Therefore, their "choice" is the local public school. Which leads to: 2) schools targeting the "rich" parents and charging $15k/year. Why? Because they can. As for charter schools, that's what would end up happening. The equivalent of charter schools getting voucher money, except it would be a system with more freedom. As for "no facilities" whatsoever, have you *seen* many of the local Catholic grade schools that are pretty full? I have. They are typically a 1950's era box stuck on a parking lot. And yet, they're full, and also providing a better education than many of their "competing" public schools.
David January 28, 2013 at 05:59 pm
And I'm still not sure why my comments keep appearing and disappearing on this particular thread.
Marga Lacabe January 28, 2013 at 08:14 pm
David, if private schools can provide a quality education by charging $9K a year but charge $15K+ because they "can", why are people not starting private schools that charge $9K-$14K a year? Again, the market is there given that right now both the $20K private and $9K Catholic schools have a waiting list.
Now, I agree with you that it's possible for someone to open a for-profit private school offering something for $9K a year, but if that something is not a quality education, then why would it be a social good to have vouchers that pay for it?
Leah Hall January 28, 2013 at 08:29 pm
"For Women Under 30, Most Births Occur Outside Marriage" NY Times 2/2012
Let's review: "One group still largely resists the trend: college graduates, who overwhelmingly marry before having children. That is turning family structure into a new class divide, with the economic and social rewards of marriage increasingly reserved for people with the most education. “Marriage has become a luxury good,” said Frank Furstenberg, a sociologist at the University of Pennsylvania. The shift is affecting children’s lives. Researchers have consistently found that children born outside marriage face elevated risks of falling into poverty, failing in school or suffering emotional and behavioral problems. The forces rearranging the family are as diverse as globalization and the pill. Liberal analysts argue that shrinking paychecks have thinned the ranks of marriageable men, while conservatives often say that the sexual revolution reduced the incentive to wed and that safety net programs discourage marriage." http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/18/us/for-women-under-30-most-births-occur-outside-marriage.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
Cheryl Farley January 30, 2013 at 06:21 am
I have taught at SLHS for 16 years, and unfortunately, Mr. Heverly's observation about the success of students according to ethnicity can be supported. Statistically speaking, gaps in academic success rates, drop-out rates, and behavior referrals exist between ethnic groups, with Asian and white students tending to perform better in schools than African-American and Latino students. Of course, that is a nationwide trend, not simply peculiar to our high school. The reasons for these gaps are far too complex to chalk up to one cause or another, and I don't believe that my colleague, Mr. Heverly believes that it is that simple either. Anyone who has read about this issue to any degree knows that addressing it requires a great deal of effort on several fronts. While I can understand a parent's concern that her son would meet with discrimination in any classroom, I want to remind everyone that raising questions shouldn't be vilified. In my experience, it is those teachers who DON'T raise important questions that we should worry about. Good teachers constantly assess their own practice, the school climate, district support, leadership, and student involvement to determine what is working and then ask the hard questions. As a last point, part of the problem is definition. Perhaps the way we define and measure success is lacking, incomplete, or narrow. Students achieve in many ways, so we must be careful not to call them failures when we need a fuller picture of success.
David January 30, 2013 at 10:23 am
Marga, the first article argues socioeconomic status is important.
the second article argues that it's important also to Hispanics. the third article argues that socioeconomic status is important. Perhaps 1 vs 2 parent households is less important than SES. As I wrote, if you believe SES matters, and all your articles do, single-parent led households in the USA have an astronomical poverty rate.
jeffrey olsen January 30, 2013 at 01:34 pm
typical PC approch we must be careful not to call the failure a failure,
probably it is success ,nobody will say better
Leah Hall January 30, 2013 at 02:15 pm
Thank you for the insightful follow up, Cheryl. A smart, related line of questioning was posted on Facebook by a friend 2 weeks ago. The writer asked that educators and politicians stop naming the complex challenge a performance gap and instead refer to it as a /resources/ gap. While I disagreed with some of the claims in the article, I felt that this underlying message is critical in debate and problem solving.

Newsletter & Alerts

Get the best stories each day and important breaking news

Subscribe

Not from San Leandro Patch? Find your Local Patch »

Note Article
Just a short thought to get the word out quickly about anything in your neighborhood.
Share something with your neighbors. Write a new post... What's up? Make an announcement, speak your mind, or sell something
David June 19, 2013 at 07:44 pm
Rob, *I* provide decent, safe, affordable housing for low income folks. It can be done. Yes, IRead More take Section 8 vouchers. Guess what, they work, and they disperse poverty so you do not end up concentrating poor people into a ghetto. All you're doing is creating ghettos. As for the religious women, surely you understand the difference between charity freely given and taxes confiscated from me at the point of a gun.
David June 19, 2013 at 07:46 pm
As previously mentioned, if there were a "shortage" of affordable housing, rather thanRead More creating a brand new ghetto in the middle of downtown SL, those tax dollars could have gone to buying up blocks of foreclosed houses and fixing them up. But you'd rather build new construction at a higher cost to taxpayers. Wonder why...
Rob Rich June 19, 2013 at 08:00 pm
If there wasn't a demand, people wouldn't be lining up dozens deep for every unit. These will beRead More nice units, well managed. There are folks buying up & rehabbing foreclosed properties. Remember, I sent you a link? As for your distaste for taxes (except perhaps when they fund your splendid education), the Sisters disagree w
Erica June 18, 2013 at 07:16 pm
What brand is the pastry cutter?
Rowena Peñalba June 18, 2013 at 11:27 pm
It's slightly used but I don't remember where I bought it from. I don't see any brand name on it. IRead More just priced it based on the lowest one available on Amazon. If you're interested, make me an offer. Maybe we can agree on it. Thanks for your inquiry.
Elaine Cooperstein June 19, 2013 at 03:16 pm
Can't remember what night this was, but recently we were startled by noises and decided it must haveRead More been fireworks at the coliseum.
Mattie Ignacio June 13, 2013 at 06:02 pm
it was a hundred times better...it is now useless!
Richard Eisenman June 14, 2013 at 11:17 am
I'm not a very regular viewer. Could you be a bit more specific about what changed recently (plusesRead More and minuses)? Thanks.
Jessica Gardner June 18, 2013 at 05:43 pm
i agree!!
Opera On Tap Co-Manager, Indre Viskontas
Joanna Dyer June 12, 2013 at 07:16 am
F
Molly Rosen June 14, 2013 at 04:36 pm
One of the best operas ever. I hope to see it. How excited for OOT and San Leandro!
Susan Reisz June 10, 2013 at 07:29 pm
Can you reprint this several times prior to June 27. I don't want people to forget about it? Thanks